Music Composed by Hans Zimmer & James Newton Howard
Additional Music by Ramin Djawadi & Mel Wesson Album Produced by Hans Zimmer & James Newton Howard Executive Album Producer: Christopher Nolan Executives in Charge of Music for Warner Bros: Doug Frank & Gary LeMel Music Orchestrated by Brad Dechter & Bruce Fowler Music Conducted by Gavin Greenaway Music Programmer: Lorne Balfe Technical Score Engineers: Mark Wherry & Abhay Manusmare Technical Assistants: Aaron Martin, Jörg Hüttner & Tristan Lillingston Assistant to James Newton Howard: Annica Ackerman Assistant to Hans Zimmer: Andrew Zack Music Editors: Steven Price & Richard Robson Assistant Music Editor: Simon Changer Orchestra Leader: Gavyn Wright Music Recorded by Geoff Foster Assistant Engineers: Chris Barrett & Ian Wood Music Mixed by Al Clay Score Co-ordination: Becky Bentham for HotHouse Music Ltd Score Reader: Alastair King Musicians Contractor: Isobel Griffiths Ltd Music Preparation: Dakota Music Service
Electric Cellist: Martin Tillman Featured Choirboy: Thomas Jesty, Head Quirister Winchester College
Music Recorded & Mixed at Air Studios, London
Album Compilation: Alan Meyerson Album Mastered by Bruce Maddocks at Cups N' Strings Album Business Affairs: Keith Zajic & Lisa Margolis Music Administration for Warner Bros.: Debi Streeter
Hans Zimmer would like to thank: Slamm Andrews, Klaus Badelt, Jeff Biggers, John Bowen, Tom Broderick, Matthias Carstens, Ronni Chasen, Kathie Davies, James Dooley, Clay Duncan, Becca Gatrell, Harry Gregson-Williams, Rupert Gregson-Williams, Bart Hendrickson, Rich Holmes, Charlene Huang, Steve Jablonsky, Arnd Kaiser, Steven Kofsky, Werner Kracht & everyone at Steinberg, James S. Levine, Abbie Lister, Henning Lohner, Brian McCall, Chet Mehta, Trevor Morris, Moanike'ala Nakamoto, Richard Nevens, Jerome Noel, Stephen Paine, Heitor Pereira, Pete Snell, Chris Strong, Jim Van Buskirk, Greg Vines, Glen Walsh, Ryan A. Watkins, Geoff Zanelli, Suzanne Zimmer & the mini Z's, Zoe Zimmer & Brigitte Zimmer
James Newton Howard would like to thank: Jim Hill, Hayden Howard & Jackson Howard
Hans Zimmer & James Newton Howard would like to thank: Alison Burton & all the staff at Air Studios, Larry Franco, Doug Frank, Michael Gorfaine, Trevor Horn, Lisa Margolis, Charles Roven, Sam Schwartz, Emma Thomas, Cheryl Tkach
With Special Thanks from Hans Zimmer & James Newton Howard to: Christopher Nolan
Special Thanks from Warner Bros. to: Christopher Nolan, Jeff Robinov, Greg Silverman, Larry Franco, Charles Roven & Emma Thomas
Thanks from Warner Bros. to: Rebecca Aguilar, Carter Armstrong, Ivona Belda, Joseph Bille, Eric Bixon, Nick Bonomo, Zack Brown, Dan Butler, Suzi Civita, Linda Colianni, Patti Connolly, Pamela Cresant, Mary Cybriwsky, Stacey Davis, Nancy Ferreira, Rose Flowers, Alan Glazer, Danny Gould, Eileen Hale, Dirk Hebert, Darry Hendrix, Carla Holt, Natalia Jacke, Gita Jackson, Ernie Johnston, Melisa Levine, Kris Little, Nigel McCorry, Debbie Miller, Melissa Musson, Joseph Palmer, Katherine Pickett, Joyce Ryan, Susannah Scott, Irika Slavin, Michelle Sparks-Gillis, Dawn Taubin, Shane Thompson, Bobby Thornburg, Cheryl Tkach, Tamara Vest & Michele Wilcox
Release date : 06/08/2005
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Batman Begins was a very collaborative work, that's why it's very hard to say who did what... They were 5, Hans, James, Ramin, Mel & Lorne working together in London for almost 3 months, discussing, sharing ideas & everything and co-writing/arranging the whole score. Apart from Backup being arranged by Lorne, I know that the Batmobile Chase was also a Lorne one. Everyone is wondering if Hans or James actually did Training, but it was Ramin... I was also told Ramin had a big role in "Lasiurus"... And JNH had much more influence on the thing than people usually think of it...
On TDK, it was not the same. The score was done in LA, and James worked from his studio, and Hans from his own. So more a split work with a few meetings, and a very big team, while Begins was a very short team for all the aspects of the score production.
Anyway, if the suites written by Hans for TDK & TDKR are fantastic, the "scores in film" in those are nowhere near the amazing Batman Begins...
I'm wondering why you posted it here, and not on the complete score. :p
But some interesting stuff. I'd never have guessed that Ramin helped out on the "Training" cue, that's one of my favorites (the way it previews the theme from "Like a Dog Chasing Cars" is amazing). Lorne working on the "Batmobile Chase" is I guess a little less surprising, but that's another favorite of mine. It always makes me a little sad to think that Hans wasn't personally responsible for those highlights, but given how he operates I'm not surprised anymore. :p
As for telling Hans and JNH apart, I've gone through and tried to do it by ear, but as you say, they're pretty seamlessly mixed. There are some parts that are obviously Hans('n'co) and some parts that are obviously James, but many bits really seem like a cross between the two, which is something unique to this score that I appreciate.
Were there ever suites for Batman Begins, by the way? The only two I can think of are Lasiurus (also cowritten by Ramin, you say?), and that Batman Theme cue. Since TDK and TDKR were so suite-based, it would be interesting if this one wasn't.
Well never sure but I don't think there's more... :)
I thought Zimmer said in an interview that he was responsible for the "car chase"...
And since "Training" basically contains Hans' New Batman Theme from TDK, does that mean Ramin is partially responsible for that theme? Or did he just arrange it from pre-existing material?
Are you saying Lorne was INVOLVED with Batmobile Chase (i.e., he and Hans actively co-wrote the cue, so Hans was indeed involved with the actual writing to that scene) or that Lorne arranged it on his own, using Hans' material/directions? Because it just has that pure Zimmer sound, a sound which only Hans himself can deliver if you know what I mean. Often it seems like the stuff not done directly by Hans lacks a certain "umph", but Batmobile Chase has it. Huh. Very interesting. I agree, both Hybrid and Edmund, that a) however much the suites from the next two movies might be good, the score within the picture is most impressive here and b) that it's a little saddening to know Hans wasn't entirely responsible for these standout cues.
It is kind of ironic that two of my favorite cues from Begins, Training and Batmobile Chase, were to some unknown degree "ghost-written". I'm not disappointed, per se, because the music is still as awesome as it's ever been, but knowing that those cues aren't just the creative genius of Hans Zimmer is a little bit of a letdown. But yeah, as Edmund said, I'm not surprised, knowing how Zimmer works.
This may be a dumb question, but if there were no suites (for things like Backup), where did the material come from for Lorne to arrange it? Did Hans write a demo version for the scene which Lorne amended as necessary? I know Zimmer reused/revamped Backup in one of the TDKR suites, so I guess it was originally written by him somewhere. But you can never tell, can you? :P
The Whole Batmoblie chase is a Lorne Alone cue. (or did he just Arrange it.)
In other words Molossus. Is that A lorne cue?
It might be safe to say Zimmer Did most of it. as the unknown guy said that umph that only Zimmer brings. now not saying Lorne didn't have a hand but it's probably safe to say Zimmer did most.
I think it's safe to say that MacArthur has absolutely no clue what he's talking about and everything that comes out of his mouth is pure and wild speculation.
In the complete score there's a track named "Batman Theme" which is the basic mock up of what Molossus would become. I'm confident that piece was originally by Zimmer. What they did with it by turning it into a batmobile chase and then using the sounds they made for that later to finish the molossus track seems to be what happened. So yeah, Lorn didn't compose the music, but he re imagined it and scored it to picture
We really have no idea how much Lorne did on that cue, MacArthur. Some of it came from the so-called "Batman Theme" by Zimmer and JNH, some of it is original material, and some of it borrows material from earlier action cues in the film, like Temple Fight (Myotis on the album). So it's definitely just "arrangements" at some points but may very well be originally Lorne Balfe in others.
If I had to guess, judging from 1) Hybrid's first comment and 2) the words of Hans in an interview from 2006 (and keep in mind this is pure speculation), I would guess that, unlike most of the cues from Zimmer that involve a ghostwriter, this one (Batmobile Chase/Molossus) was indeed actively co-written by Hans and Lorne together, hence that "Pure Zimmer Umph" that one comment mentioned. I feel like this is the case from Hybrid's comment: "They were 5, Hans, James, Ramin, Mel, & Lorne...discussing, sharing ideas and everything *and co-writing the whole score*". That really makes it sound like even in the "ghostwritten" cues, Zimmer had an active role in writing them, more than he usually does.
Reason 2 I would guess it was actively co-written by Hans and Lorne (not just arranged by Lorne with Hans giving the basic idea) is that Hans said in a 2006 interview, "On Batman Begins...I knew we were going to have a car chase, but I knew it wasn't going to be the stereotypical car chase, absolutely no way. But Chris [Nolan] hadn't really attacked that scene yet, and hadn't really figured it out. So *I wrote the car chase music* as a kind of Lego set, since I knew he was going to move the picture around like crazy...So it just became this Lego set, and as Chris was moving chunks of car chase around, it was very easy to adjust".
My thinking is that maybe Hans wrote the initial cue and is indeed responsible for the basic cue, then Lorne did the "adjusting" Hans mentioned. But I'd be happy if Hybrid wanted to share greater knowledge about this.
See, at least when Mike speculates, he does it by backing it up with reasoning and good arguments, and he admits that's he's speculating. Which is why I'm inclined to believe what he says, and inclined to ridicule what MacArthur says.
Thank you mike for answering my question.
What to say, I don't know. Lorne was more of an arranger back in those days...
But I know he spent weeks on that particular cue... So yeah I guess it's the Batman Theme suite tracked in, arranged, with HZ at the end, and lots of programming & arranging and some writing by Lorne (& Mel for the ambient / samples). As I say it was very collaborative... Remember the Batmobile Chase has themes by JNH too lol...
"...with HZ at the end."
you mean "with hans doing the final part of the cue"?
Yeah I meant the Black Rain rip off...
Actually now that I think of it, that was another reason I figured Hans was actively involved with it, because of the carbon copy of the Black Rain cue. lol.
if lorne did the batmobile chase cue do you know if he also did the action cues heard in antrozus? cause it reprises a lot of the chase cues. and if the part beginning at 1:59 in antrozus (also in the chase cue) is originally by lorne and not hans, that would explain why lorne is credited with additional MUSIC and not just arrangements in the next two movies. :) but if the cues in antrozus (also in molossus :P) are orginally by hans, then the chase cue was just an arrangement of pre-existing material.
Lorne just told me that he didn't compose "molossus".
I've known Lorne for 5 years, if there's one guy you must NOT listen to get any info on HZ, it's him. He'll never say a WORD...
BTW to get back on that old subject, I should share Lorne's story he told about Hans for the HZ Live on Tour booklet :
Lorne Balfe : "Batman Begins was the first film I worked on with Hans. I had managed to get the man flu half way through the project and James (Newton Howard) and Hans did not want me anywhere near them! I got back to my hotel to find a doctor waiting in my room. Hans had kindly organized his visit. An hour later I was told I had a temperature of 103 Fahrenheit and I must stay in bed. The phone immediately went. It was Hans's assistant Abhay. "Hans wants to know how you are?" I was very touched by his concern and repeated what the doctor had advised. Then I heard a deep German voice screaming in the background, "Ask how long does he intend to be ill for, the bat mobile chase STILL isn't finished." I left my hotel room 50 seconds later..."
so i guess the thing i need to get straight is this... how much does a guy like hans zimmer *need* help and how much does he just like it for the sake of a collaborative experience on the project? you say he doesn't right as fast as lorne balfe does, okay, but the man has been working on movies for 30 years and has gotten stuff done before lorne and others came around. and not only that, in batman begins' case he had james newton howard and ramin djawadi to work with, and it seems like between the three of them, the cue could get done with or without lorne.
i'm not saying this to criticize balfe or zimmer, but i'd be surprised if zimmer really *needed* balfe's contributions in order to finish his projects. does that make sense?
The answer is both. Why would you collaborate with someone unless you enjoy it? Why would you work with them if you didn't feel they could add something. It's a stupid question.
Open up other composers pages on here and the additionals do a few cues. Open up some of Hans, and Lorne has written 80% of the music for him. No wonder he doesn't answer questions on it! LOL
He's never going to say in an interview "yes Hans wrote 2 minutes of basic sketches and I wrote most of the score". Hybrid has explained the process in detail plenty of times. But the music speaks for itself.
All that matters is the result. Would the scores be better without Lorne, Dooley and Zanelli etc. is the real question. I think the answer is no.
We all just need to accept that Hans has his own work style, and that, for better or worse, this involves collaborating with / getting help from other people. Hans may or may not "need" the help. Hans may or may not do better work with the help. But regardless of how or why he works, and regardless of how his scores get credited, we all know this **is** how he works.
I'm not trying to be harsh, and heck, I've been guilty of this in the past, but you'd think we'd stop *expecting* the highlights of Hans' scores to be done by Hans, or most of Hans' scores to be done by Hans. Sometimes it goes that way, sometimes in doesn't, but as Zimmer himself said, "He doesn't give a flying ****" about who ends up doing what. Batman Begins is no different. Future scores will be no different.
Interstellar was written mostly (if not only) by Hans himself, and the score is one of his finest, in my opinion.
Some scores were very long to produce (without much time), I'm thinking about POTCs for exemple, and one man alone couldn't achieve that.
Or Rango for exemple, where Hans was asked pretty late in the process to start again the composing process because the first score didn't satisfy the production... Sometimes without Lorne, Geoff etc... there would be no music at all !
I agree about Interstellar, but I think its quality was mostly due to its genuine innovation, instrumentally / style-wise. I appreciate that Hans went at it alone (basically), but I don't think others' input would have made a drastic influence.
So... can we expect any Nolan-Batman Easter eggs in Lorne Balfe's Lego Batman score?
idk why there would be... sure he worked on all three films to an extent but none of his contributions were massive as far as the overall imprint of the scores... and at that point he'd just as sensibly reference hans zimmer as danny elfman or any other batman composer... but we'll see!
Yeah, true. But I feel like he might throw in some little reference, considering he had a hand in three different movies for the character before the Lego one.
Lemme see if I have this right, because the album has the cues way out of order:
1. Vespertilio = opening logos/the walk up the mountain 2. Eptesicus = the flashback after the campfire and the training scenes 3. Myotis = the temple fight, saving Ducard, and Bruce going back to Gotham 4. Barbastella = Death of the Waynes and the Batcave 5. Artibeus = Dock scenes and Ducard's first appearance 6. Tadarida = Rachel in the Batcave after the Tumbler chase, followed by "He's here" "Who?" "The Bat-Man!", followed by Batman on fire, followed by the scene where the microwave is stolen 7. Macrotus = the happy scenes with Bruce's parents, followed by the facing fear sequence in the monastery, followed by the music when Joe Chill is shot 8. Antrozus = Batman revealing his identity to Rachel and fighting the LoS 9. Nycteris = Bruce being shown Lucius' equipment and the "Why bats?" scene 10. Molossus = Tumbler chase 11. Corynorhinus = the final scenes 12. Lasiurus = a theme suite
Antrozus also includes Batman talking to Gordon at Gordon's house. ;) Otherwise, it looks right. I kinda wish the album had the end credits rather than Lasiurus. Lasiurus is a lovely piece, but having the end credits would have really rounded out the album more for me. If we had the end credits, we'd have Back Up (slightly edited, sure), part of Bruce Left for Dead, and the "Batman theme" all in one, and the album length would have been about the same.
I don't get it why Zimmer never used the Batman theme again in any of the sequels!
I don't want to sound like a moron (or like MacArthur), but where can I find this mysterious, never-again used Batman theme everyone is talking about? It bothers me that I think of something as a "Batman theme", and everybody seems to know about some other, "more true" theme.
Look up "Batman Begins Expanded Score - Batman theme", or if you're willing to skip about the first minute of it, skip to about 6:57 in the end credits (which can be easily found on YouTube) and listen from there. Pieces of the theme are used in "Molossus", and it has the typical Zimmer-Batman-staccato sound.
If you're familiar with the score, said theme is nothing groundbreaking or different. And besides, even if it was written to be a fully-fledged theme, the two notes took it over in the end and became the theme instead.
it's from 0:40 on in Molossus. The leitmotiv is also heart in the "I'm Batman" scene and at the end when he jumps of the rooftop after talking to Gordon. It's also heard in the TDK trailer
it's also differently arranged in the boy soprano
0-cool, I see you were thinking of a different "theme" than I was. I was referring to the officially titled "Batman Theme" from the expanded score.
I think that the theme 0-cool is talking about was changed a bit and used from JNH as the Harvey Dent theme, because the music underneath is approximately the same. The "Dent theme" version was also used in Myotis (3:16).
So, Hybrid, if Mel Wesson did the more ambient cues, does that mean he did Dockyard Ambush Part 1, Why Bats, and Crane Interrogated?
He didn't do "the most ambient" cues, he did all the ambient stuff in the whole score... He's like everywhere... And yes of course he has some "solo" cues as well, which are pretty obvious : B Titles, Bruce Discomfort, Mugging Pt 1, Crane Warns Rachel Pt 2, Crane's Mask & Crane Interrogated... And for the rest I think there's just a dozen cues he didn't have a hand (directly or indirectly) on...
Hmm, interesting. Thanks!
Wesson gets credited a lot on the cues that have the "bat flaps" in them, I've noticed. I'm guessing they were Zimmer's idea, but Wesson was the one who actually designed and implemented them?
That seems to be the case if the following interview statement from Zimmer is correct (but, you know, a lot of what's said in interviews needs to be taken with a grain of salt):
"I was in Los Angeles and Chris was in London. Mel Wesson was in London too, so I suggested Mel go to over to the cutting room, to see what sort of thing we needed to start off with. My feeling was that it didn’t even really have to be a piece of music. It just had to be something really iconic, like the flapping of ginormous wings or something. So Mel created that, and that was a good start."
I'm rather surprised no one has really mentioned (that I've read -- apologies if someone has) what I consider to be a stark resemblance of the superb theme at the end of the TDKR "Moody New Bruce Hero Suite" (which, on that track, really begins at 19:10) to the MOS theme "What Are You Going To Do....".
Obviously, the TDKR theme in that track is MUCH slower, but the overall cue has a very similar emotion, epicness, chord progression, etc. I always wondered why it was not used in the film. A superb cue to me. (For those wondering, it's also available in the Z+ App).
Am I alone on this one?
Sorry everyone. Thought I was on a MOS post!
I quite agree about wondering why it wasn't in the film. Darned Chris Nolan always insists on reusing old music, but there was a lot of good material in that suite besides the part you mention which would have been awesome onscreen.
Mr. H zimmer .. truthfully m nt a huge fan of urs bt i hve olways been an admirer ov ur work.....besides the cossack's chase ...d soundtrack of davy jones in pirates of Caribbean was owsm.....thanx fr such gr8 tracks
Has anybody else noticed that in TDKR's "Wayne Manor" suite, there are new, more staccato versions of two Batman Begins cues (the one in "Tadarida", played when the Scarecrow lights Batman on fire, and then the "Backup" cue)?
Hybrid, can you tell us, which tracks by Zimmer, and which by Howard?
He's said many times that doing that is impossible, since the whole score is truly the work of both composers (with Hans sometimes using James' themes and James sometimes using Hans' themes). Apparently TDK was more clear-cut.
I'm pretty baffled by the credits here. The are moments that, to me, clearly sound like Zimmer's contributions. I'm thinking of Eptesicus, Myotis, and Lasirius. There are parts in those tracks that sound so much like HZ that I wonder if the credits are wrong or JNH was really trying to copy HZ's sound.
1. Opening Titles - Young Bruce Falls (2:04) 2. Prison Nightmare (1:04) 3. Meeting Ducard (2:00) 4. The Long Walk (2:24) 5. Monastery (2:47) 6. Father to the Rescue (2:13) 7. Bruce's Discomfort (0:37) 8. Mugging (Part 1) (1:18) 9. Mugging (Part 2) - Gordon Comforts Bruce (2:50) 10. Training (2:51) 11. Campfire - Bruce Goes Home (3:28) 12. Courthouse (Part 1) (2:40) 13. Your System is Broken (0:57) 14. Meeting Falcone (3:10) 15. Decision (2:31) 16. Hide in the Dark (3:01) 17. Initiation Into the League - Temple Fight - Saving Ducard (6:29) 18. Return to Gotham (0:53) 19. Crane Warns Rachel A (1:00) 20. Crane Warns Rachel B (1:21) 21. The Bat Cave (3:01) 22. Wayne Enterprises (1:26) 23. Prototypes (1:40) 24. Preparing Equipment (1:48) 25. Batman Visits Gordon (1:12) 26. I Need You at the Docks - Why Bats (2:35) 27. Dockyard Ambush (3:09) 28. Rachel Attacked (2:24) 29. Microwave Stolen (1:26) 30. Meeting Rachel (1:38) 31. Crane's Mask (0:43) 32. Gordon At Home (1:27) 33. Batman On Fire (2:33) 34. Finder's Keepers (1:41) 35. Fox is Fired (1:13) 36. Making Medicine (4:10) 37. Fight in Crane's Lab (5:01) 38. Back Up (1:34) 39. Batmobile Chase (5:01) 40. Rachel in Bat Cave (1:26) 41. Your Father's Name (0:57) 42. Crane Interrogated (0:34) 43. Ducard Appears (1:10) 44. Ducard and Gotham's Fate - Bruce Left For Dead (6:39) 45. Rachel Gives Gordon the Antidote (3:32) 46. Batman Arrives (2:29) 47. Batman Rescues Rachel - Fight With League (2:55) 48. Final Confrontation (1:20) 49. Train Fight (3:18) 50. Danger Over (0:54) 51. Surveying the Ruins (3:21) 52. Gordon Says Thanks (1:50) 53. End Credits (9:03) 54. Batman Theme (3:16) 55. Prison Nightmare (Alt.) (1:04) 56. Monastery (Alt.) (2:46) 57. Father to the Rescue (Alt.) (2:13) 58. Mugging (Part 1) (Alt.) (1:07) 59. Mugging (Part 2) - Gordon Comforts Bruce (Alt.) (2:51) 60. Training (Alt. 1) (3:00) 61. Training (Alt. 3) (2:52) 62. Campfire - Bruce Goes Home (Alt. 1) (3:29) 63. Campfire - Bruce Goes Home (Alt. 2) (3:29) 64. Your System is Broken (Alt.) (0:56) 65. Meeting Falcone (Alt.) (3:10) 66. Decision (Alt.) (2:32) 67. Crane Warns Rachel A (Alt.) (1:00) 68. Crane Warns Rachel B (Alt.) (1:21) 69. Preparing Equipment (Alt.) (1:54) 70. I Need You at the Docks - Why Bats (Alt.) (2:35) 71. Batman On Fire (Alt.) (2:28) 72. Batmobile Chase (Alt.) (4:52) 73. Gordon Says Thanks (Alt.) (1:51) 74. Original End Credits (7:15)
real, sfx free
Dude, the Complete Score has been out for several weeks, if not a month now. Where have you been?